by Gary Gilliam (spooky_bear@hotmail.com)

In the preparation of a definitive essay about the band The Duckhills, which, in the best case scenario, would be used as the liner notes for a possible remixed/ remastered cd collection, I sat down with frontman SAVE Hotchkiss to discuss the gaps in my memory surrounding the band’s history.

Part I: The Other Version

GG: So, I want to approach this like we're just reminiscing in some kind of a logical order.

SH: No, you gotta ask me questions [about historical details] that you have discrepancies with.

GG: Yeah, but I want to keep it informal.

SH: Right, ok.

GG: So, I met you in, I think, December of '87 and The Other Version was already together with you and Chad [Malone]. At that point you guys had already done the 4-song EP, Revolving Light. Is that right?

SH: [Yes] we did Revolving Light before I went to college in '87. It was that summer.

GG: How did that come about?

SH: Revolving Light was a pointed attempt at working with Michael Knust. He used to be in a band called Fever Tree, who were big in San Francisco in the 60's. They had a [hit] song called "San Francisco Girls."

GG: Let's go back a little bit further. When did you first start fooling around with singing?

SH: Oh, I always loved singing. I grew up singing. I was always [singing] in class, knew all the words to every Elvis song, and then, later, it became Beatle songs. So, I was always singing. Always.

GG: You met Chad in drama class and eventually you were both in the band Organized Confusion.

SH: Yeah, Chad was somehow in drama for a little while and he invited me to come sing with Organized Confusion who were playing the "Klein [High School] Jam" my senior year.

GG: And you had never sung before that…in front of an audience?

SH: I had not been in a band, no. Chad still has all the live footage of those shows which I want because that was my first taste of the crowd going nuts.

GG: Who wrote for that band?

SH: There was this guy named Paul who was the [original] singer for that band [who] was a real metal head and he wrote terrible, terrible lyrics about…you know, like…[Singing], "It was 1720 when I first saw his face, a mariner he was, with a death-like gaze…"

GG: Oh my God.

SH: He was trying to write metal tunes and that was what they were aspiring to be, you know, kind of that medieval, Iron Maiden sort of thing. [Thinking.] Actually, that's how I met Randy [Grace and Jim Thompson]. I went down to the [Michael Knust] studio to record that song to be on a "Klein Jam" compilation thing. Somewhere Michael Knust has a recording of that song.

GG: [The compilation] was sold at the "Klein Jam"?

SH: No, it wasn't, it never came to fruition. The school wouldn't end up funding the money to do it, so Randy just used whatever time was left for our own demo tapes [Revolving Light] later on. But, anyway, I met [them] there at that thing. I sang and Randy was there producing it. None of the rest of my band members, except for Steven Wilder, was there with me recording that. I just came in and he gave me the lyrics and I just did it. And I remember standing in the control room with Jim and Randy and when they heard that lyric back I remember Jim saying …[Doing a dead-on imitation of Jim Thompson], "It's real important to say the date in a song." [Laughs.]

GG: [Laughs.]

SH: Then when I saw them at the "Klein Jam" it was real bad, it didn't go very well for them. [They failed] miserably.

GG: What were they called then?

SH: They were called The Other Version. But I knew that what Randy and Jim were attempting was a "10" difficulty level versus our "5." I knew that they had the right idea about what music was supposed to be about. And when you're in high school it's real tempting to just play to the masses and do what's popular.

GG: Were they doing some of the songs that you would end up doing with them?

SH: Yes, [but] it didn't go over well. They had all kinds of feedback problems and when you're in high school you don't give credit to people when they have [technical] problems. You don't understand what feedback is, you just think that they sound shitty. So, that's why it wasn't going well for them.

GG: So, right after the "Klein Jam" you graduated?

SH: Yeah, [and then that summer is when] Chad said, "Hey, their drummer is leaving and they want me to drum and I said I think you should come sing for us." Chad brought me in.

GG: How did Chad know them well enough for them to invite him in?

SH: Well, you know how Chad is. I'm sure he just went up and thought, "Wow, they're doing stuff like U2, I want to play with them." They were trying to get Curtis Bay to sing.

GG: Another Mormon?

SH: Yeah, so it would have been two Mormons.

GG: Did they audition you?

SH: They did audition me. I went over to Randy's house and I was singing whatever they had. They had me try "With or Without You," which is not exactly an easy song to sing, but Randy could make that little loop and it was very cutting edge for high school. And then Jim started playing…[Sings intro baseline of "Roadhouse Blues"]…'cause he loved The Doors. I was trying to do my own voice at first and then Jim said, "Sing more like Jim Morrison, if you can…a little more fire." So…I did it, and I could do a pretty good imitation, I guess, for a high-schooler. And I could just see Jim goin', "Yeah!"…[Doing a dead-on imitation of Jim bobbing his head up and down in approval]…Totally diggin' it…[Imitating Jim's voice], "That's the one…that's pretty good."

GG: [Laughs excessively.]

SH: Then they reluctantly let me into the band. I don't think Randy wanted me in the band that much, it was kind of default.

GG: And what was the first order of business once you were a member? The tape? Revolving Light?

SH: Yeah, they had some songs that Randy had written and one that Jim had made, "Standby," which had the exact…EXACT "Bullet the Blue Sky" beat behind it, which I remember complaining about at the time and everyone going, "Aw, it's fine," and now it's the most humiliating…piece of evidence.

GG: What was the creative process back then? Would Randy write a song on guitar and then bring it to the band?

SH: He'd kind of tell us what he wanted. It was Randy's band, I was just a singer. I just came there to sing. That's all I was there to do, at first.

GG: Did you do "I Need Me" during those sessions?

SH: Yeah, we did. There is an official recording of that but it didn't go on the EP.

GG: When did you write that song? That was your first song, right?

SH: Yeah. What happened was, it was during [that] summer and I was watching Help! alot. "You're Gonna Lose That Girl" was playing and [I thought], "Oh, I can follow that formula and write a song."

GG: Did you know how to play guitar when you wrote that?

SH: Nope, I didn't know how to play. So, I went over to Randy's house one night. Randy had his own apartment that summer which is where everyone hung out. It was basically just a couch, beer cans everywhere, and a little 4-track…it was so spare. So, I went over there and I sang him the words and he put some chords to it that he thought fit the key I was kind of singing in.

GG: You know it's on the site, right?

SH: It is?! [ed. Yes, it is :-) ]

GG: [Laughs.] Well Jeff has it, I don't know if he put it up yet.

SH: I hope not.

GG: I really like it. How come it wasn't on the tape?

SH: I don't know. I don't think that anyone thought it was right. I didn't think it was right. It didn't sound like the rest of the songs.

GG: So, you all went back to school in September and the tape went off to be printed up…

SH: It was sent to me at college [North Carolina School of the Arts]. I remember playing it for people and being really proud.

GG: The band was really apart for a big chunk of time then. Were you learning how to play guitar during that period?

SH: Yeah, I had an acoustic guitar. That's where I learned. I had a Beatles songbook and I played; I'd just drive my roommate nuts. Played all the frickin' time.

GG: Were you writing?

SH: Well, I revamped "Cold Window," which was Jim's song. He sent me the lyrics and I revamped it. I just changed every verse and kept the chorus. I [also] wrote "Nothing" in college. I remember thinking that was a big breakthrough.

GG: What about "The Cliché"?

SH: Oh, "The Cliché," that was also written in college. That was written with 2 friends of mine when we were on acid in the back of somebody's dorm apartment [during] a party. We [took turns writing lines] then we just put it all together and it became this song. Then I went out and performed "Already Gone" [from Revolving Light] and that song at a coffee house on acoustic guitar and they were like, "Oh, you gotta start playing here all the time!"

GG: Did you ever play there again?

SH: No.

GG: You quit college during that first semester because you had decided that you wanted to focus all your energy on being in a band, right?

SH: Yeah, I felt like [I] could always go back to being an actor but [I couldn't] always be a musician. I wanted to make it while I was young and I thought that I would probably have a pretty good chance. I wanted to be the next Beatles, you know.

GG: You had all gone off to different colleges that year, except Chad. Chad had another year of high school left, which meant The Other Version was eligible to play the "Klein Jam" the following year ['88].

SH: Right, we barely snuck in.

GG: And that was your first real live show as The Other Version…I've seen a video of that and I remember the crowd really got into it; it was a huge success for you guys.

SH: Yeah, [but] it wasn't as good as when I was with Organized Confusion the year before.

GG: Really?!

SH: Oh, no, no, no way. When Organized Confusion played the crowd rushed the stage and everyone was up there, just like, screaming and…they went out of their minds.

GG: But The Other Version was a better band, obviously…

SH: Well, it was different, it was more subdued…you know, it was our own songs. But Organized Confusion was a good band, actually. We had a great guitar player, Steve Wilder, big, fat dude…awesome.

GG: Did he ever do anything after that?

SH: He went on to some school and took classical guitar and then I think he gave it all up.

GG: "Mormonfest" [our term for a show played at a local Mormon church] in May was your next gig. How did that happen?

SH: Chad. Curtis [Bay] might have had something to do with it.

GG: Was that a good experience for you?

SH: [It was] very weird.

GG: You were doing a lot of covers then, at the point, to flesh out the shows…what did you play at the "Klein Jam"?

SH: We did [R.E.M.'s] "Superman." We played it terribly.

GG: I remember you did "Nobody Told Me" at "Mormonfest."

SH: Oh, we did? We also did "Happiness is a Warm Gun."

GG: So, after "Mormonfest," that summer, you started hitting some of the Houston venues: Public Interest, which was your first actual club gig, and then later Fitzgerald's, The Axiom…

SH: [The Public Interest show] was the first time I ever heard Frank Zappa. Somebody before we went on was playing a Frank Zappa tape and I was like, "What the fuck is this, this is so cool!" It was "Dinah Moe Humm." And I remember just sitting there going, "Wow, this is truly…odd."

GG: Let's bring in Dalton [Norman] at this point because I think [your songwriting partnership] Marital Status would play a role in the direction The Duckhills ended up moving towards.

SH: The whole year that I was off from college ['88-'89] and waiting for the band to get back together I spent with Dalton, every night, high on dope… recording, making up songs on the spot, into a [cheap] jam box. Sometimes we would use an extension mike if we wanted to get really fancy. He bought a stereo mike from Radio Shack, one that [had] the two [prongs] pointing in either direction. That was when our recordings got really hot.

GG: A few of the songs you wrote together ended up in the Duckhill repertoire. There was "Maggot"…"Plaindom"…

SH: [Also] "Murder isn't Front Page News" and "Think God" [from Remembering Spongecake].

GG: Where did you record?

SH: [At my apartment] because Dalton was ashamed of his [family's trailer home] and he wasn't allowed to have company. And my mom was over at my stepfather's house every night, so I had the whole house to myself.

GG: How did you guys meet?

SH: I met Dalton in history class, junior year. There was some guy in my class named Paul and I was talking about The Beatles, 'cause I always was talking about The Beatles, and he goes, "Hey, you should go talk to that guy, Dalton, over there, he's a big Beatles fan." So, I walked up to Dalton [and] I said, "Hey, I hear you're a big Beatles fan." And Dalton was the absolute outcast of the school, I mean, no one talked to him. He didn't talk to anybody, he just sat there totally quiet, and I assumed that he was really stupid. But he was just extremely quiet and shat upon for years, you know, by his peers. So, I [asked him if he was a Beatles fan] and he said, "Yeah, I am," and then he started talking to me about The Beatles and he made me a list of all the albums he had. It was my first notion of collecting albums, he had tons more than me. That's when I found out that his parents sold stuff at flea markets and he had been shopping [for records] at flea markets for years. Which [was] way ahead of it's time, if you think about it. Now, kids do that all the time. He was scavenging through 25 cent records and finding treasures.

GG: Did you go with him?

SH: Yeah, I started going with him. And [eventually he said], "We should start going without my parents, we'll just hang out."

GG: Were you mainly going after Beatles stuff?

SH: Definitely, after Beatles stuff. Or McCartney solo stuff, especially, too. We wanted all that stuff 'cause there was so much of it and we considered it rare and exciting. And it was very fun to get it and be able play something for each other that we had never heard before.

GG: So, I guess when you went off to college you lost touch with each other and when you came back you started writing together?

SH: Yeah, and that's where I developed my sense of…anything goes. I knew we were onto something with merit that was unusual. We knew a few things. We knew Robyn Hitchcock, we knew Syd Barrett …

GG: At that point you knew about Robyn Hitchcock?

SH: Yeah, when I came back from college I brought back [Invisible Hitchcock] and played it for Dalton and I remember him just freaking out, laughing his ass off. That's where it all comes from, really, this whole sense of the wackiness, the weirdness, the quirkiness, it all comes from me and Dalton. Because Randy wasn't quirky. [That's] what I supplied to The Duckhills. The wackiness that you hear, the sense of humor approach, that kind of ethic comes from listening to Syd Barrett and Robyn Hitchcock. [Pauses.] I'm getting a little bit tired of the interview now.

GG: Ok, it's a good point to stop. We got to the summer of '88.

SH: [Laughs.] Only fourteen more years!

Next installment: The Birth of The Duckhills!

Copyright © 2002 Staine Media.

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